Episode 77: Doing Business In and With China – Part One
Hello, it’s Mike and Dave! This is our first official podcast together. We figured a good first episode was to compare notes about our experiences with doing business in and with China. Dave and I both import our products from China and for the most part, we’ve both had great results from it.
This topic will be a two-parter. Today we answer some questions about China. If you are thinking about getting into importing from China or any other foreign country, this two-part series will hopefully prepare you for what to expect.
Here are some of the points we discussed today:
- When did we start importing from China?
- How the market has changed since we started our importing.
- Why China really is “the factory of the world.”
- What it is like to import from other countries, besides China.
- Dave’s tips for optimizing your inventory costs.
- The benefits of having a large product catalog.
- What we hate about doing business with China.
- What we love about doing business with China.
Just a reminder, I am speaking at some events this year. Here is a list of those events.
- Ecommerce All Stars — Austin, TX, August 4-5.
- Global Sources — Hong Kong, October 17-19.
- EcommerceFuel Live — Laguna Beach, CA, January 11-13, 2018.
Also, keep in mind we are launching an Ecom Crew course around September. If you are interested in being part of that visit www.ecomcrew.com/course, if you sign-up we’ll let you know when the course is ready. The first few people to purchase the course will receive a 25% discount.
This episode is sponsored by Stamped.io. We have recently switched to Stamped.io, so we can get the most out of our reviews, and they have a really great product. We are proud to partner with them and there is a link below to check them out.
Resources Mentioned Today:
If you have any questions or anything you’d like us to discuss on the podcast you can now email us directly at ecomcrew.com! Just send those emails to email@example.com. Also, we would really appreciate if you would leave us a review on iTunes. Thanks for listening!
Full Audio Transcript
Mike: This is Mike.
Dave: This is Dave.
Mike: And welcome to EcomCrew episode number 77. It’s fun to have Dave here for our first full episode. Welcome to the show my friend.
Dave: Thank you Mike. Yeah I’m super excited to be here for I guess my third time on the podcast, but kind of the official first time as a regular member here.
Mike: Yeah, and obviously we kind of did like an intro episode last week. So everyone that listened to that episode knows that your background is in importing from China. At least you ran a site called Chinese Importing for quite a while, which we are going to be merging into EcomCrew. So we’re kind of talking that this will be like a first good full length episode to do and so we are going to do this episode here on doing business in and with China, and actually it’s going to be a two part since we have so much to cover. So, ready to dig into it Dave?
Dave: Let’s do it.
Mike: All right man. So the first thing we have on our list here is: When did we start importing from China? So I will let you take it first here.
Dave: All right, so I started importing from China, well I worked with a friend of my family I guess in the early 2000s. We were importing boat anchors from China. I was helping him kind of do his websites and his eBay listings that type of thing. I eventually broke off from him in 2008, and that’s when I first started importing from China. I still remember it clearly: importing like ten boat anchors from China and all of a sudden the freight forwarder calls me and they are like, “Hey Dave, you’ve got to come pick up these anchors.”
And I had no idea that they didn’t get delivered to your door step. So I drove down there with my Chevrolet Cavalier, and loaded up these ten, 50 pound anchors into my car, and I’ll never forget it. So 2008 is when I officially started.
Mike: Nice, at some point I’ll talk about my having to unload stuff off the container story, but that’s not when I first got started so I’ll save that for later. But for me the first thing, I actually started importing from Canada. Believe it or not we have a manufacturer that we work with in Canada that kind of came with the IceWraps site when we bought that and that was first like white label product that we had created. And a couple of months after we launched that and we saw some success with it is when we started importing from China.
It was for icewraps.com which would announce some of our branded, health and fitness products. And it would have been in the summer of 2015, which is crazy because that’s only really two years ago when I think about like the amount of stuff we are importing now. We are importing seven figures of stuff a year from China. And just like how far we’ve come, how quickly it’s kind of crazy. It kind of fits my personality of when you see something working just double down on it and double down on it again, and double down on it again. So, that’s kind of where we are at with China.
So the next question we have here: is there still meat on the bone importing from china? What do you think about that?
Dave: I mean I still definitely think there is meat on the bone. I guess the type of meat has changed a little bit from where it was when I first began. So 2008 obviously it was a lot easier to sell products here if you are importing from China. I mean realistically you could just import the product, do absolutely no modifications to it, have a totally crappy product description, one photograph that’s terrible quality, put it up for sale on eBay and it would sell no problem and you’d probably make four times your money.
Now I think the expectations of the product and the marketing, both of them kind of combined are changing. So I think there is more work that’s required from people who are importing from China both in terms of the product and the marketing. But by the same token, it’s also easier to import from China now. I mean there are so many more services to actually get your products here from China. Alibaba was around when I first started importing. But like in terms of freight forwarders that are used to dealing with small online sellers, there is just a whole bunch of those types of freight forwarders now who are much more accustomed to dealing with a small time seller. When I first started, every freight forwarder was used to dealing with somebody importing containers per month. So it’s definitely a lot easier now, I think, for a small guy to import from China, and I still think there is meat on the bones. Just like I said it’s a different type of meat.
Mike: Yeah, and we don’t have as much history, so I can’t really speak to how things were in 2008. It seems crazy, but I was still in online poker market back then. It’s a totally different world, totally different life, really, it feels like now. But I certainly think that there is meat left on the bone. We wouldn’t be doing it if there wasn’t. The whole reason we got into it, and started doubling down on it, and like I said, doubling down again, doubling down again is because we are making more money doing this even with our overhead than I can on the stock market on even a good year.
So I mean we are turning our inventory about three times per year let’s say conservatively, and making let’s say 25% per inventory turn. Again completely conservatively all in with the expenses paid and everything. And you annualize that out with compounding interest, and there is still a huge opportunity in my mind importing from China. So I think maybe it’s drying up from Alibaba end, what do you think about that?
Dave: I think, I mean Alibaba is still the place to be. If you can find your suppliers through trade shows or even directly contacting them, finding their website either through Google or anywhere else, via friends or let’s say just getting referrals from suppliers, that’s the best way. I still think Alibaba, for better or worse, is probably where nine out of ten people are beginning their searches. So yeah, I mean it’s definitely harder if your only source of suppliers is Alibaba. But I still think if you are finding suppliers through Alibaba it’s still possible, but it’s just going to be a little bit harder.
Mike: Yeah, yeah, I mean I think that that’s definitely pretty fair.
Dave: I was just going to ask a little rebuttal to you. In the two or three years since you’ve been importing from China, do you think it’s changed much? Like in terms of the expectations both in product development and marketing, has it changed even at that narrow of a time frame, or has it kind of been consistent for you?
Mike: That’s interesting. I think the thing that I’ve definitely noticed, I don’t know if this is some… allow me to compare A to B, so I’ll throw it back, the question at you. One thing I definitely have noticed is prices going up. We’ve gotten emails from suppliers saying material costs have gone up. So that has changed. How about for you? Have you seen that happen?
Dave: I mean material prices have definitely gone up. Freight costs have come way down as you’ve probably experienced. So I think they have kind of traded off with one another, but, definitely it depends what kind of material you are importing, like stainless steel and any type of steel has gone through the roof. Other materials seem to have remained somewhat consistent so I think I guess it depends what type of material you are importing.
Again if you have like a plastic based product, oil has come down quite a bit in the last couple of years so I think plastic based products have really come down in price. So it more or less depends I think on the material, the type of material and the type of material that your products are being constructed out of to really determine whether the products have been increasing in price or kind of staying the same.
Mike: Yeah, it definitely makes sense. And I guess the other thing that I’ve noticed just in China is just it seems like either, it’s one of two things: either the manufacturers are getting more sophisticated, meaning that I see more of them on Amazon themselves directly, or I become more self-aware of that fact. And it’s something that definitely scares me a little bit. I’m not sure what your take is on that.
Dave: Yes, every time I go to China I meet with suppliers and the first thing they always ask is, “Oh, how can I get on Amazon?” And like I even have suppliers now adding me on Facebook, just so they can kind of like, kind of pick my brain about how to sell on Amazon. Every single supplier in China wants to sell on Amazon, like nobody is oblivious to it. Every single one I think is aware of the big potential of Amazon in the US, and if they are not on Amazon right now, they are all trying to get onto Amazon.
But with that being said I mean they are pretty unsophisticated when it comes to selling on Amazon. You can definitely tell the Chinese suppliers from the non-Chinese suppliers. So I think you know, they have the advantage in getting lower product prices, but they are still really soft around the marketing end. It’s pretty clear when you are reading a description from a Chinese supplier.
Mike: Yeah, it’s still on Chinglish. So what about other countries? Have you explored other Asian countries or just other parts of the world for importing as well?
Dave: Like you, I mean I’ve imported from the US, I have imported from Canadian suppliers. I’ve never actually ventured outside of Canada, the US and China, because I think more or less China is still the factory of the world. So places like Vietnam, even India, yes their labor costs are way lower. They theoretically can produce products at a much cheaper price but their level of quality can’t even compare to China.
And I think that’s where the opportunity with China really exists right now: it’s the fact that China is really low price, but it’s also really high quality, and you know that’s pretty rare to find in this world. Normally high quality is associated with high price, but it’s kind of this little schism in the world where China creates great quality products for the most part, but has really low prices.
Mike: You know, we also import from Guatemala, just there is some particular reasons for that, which is like some garment stuff, labor is also cheap down there. It’s also kind of part of our story that we are working on telling that WildBaby is just helping single mothers in villages down there. There is definitely a lot of poverty and stuff so we are happy to be helping in that regard. And the labor rates are, like I said, they are cheap compared to China as well.
Vietnam is definitely the country that I keep hearing about a lot. Obviously Grant who was on the podcast before went to Vietnam and has been bringing stuff in from Vietnam for CuttingBoard. The labor rates down there are definitely significantly cheaper, and that’s really what it comes down to. I mean you are basically overcharging labor when you go to China. You can probably make it cheaper here if the labor rate was the same, because you would skip all the shipping and everything.
So if you have a country like Vietnam that definitely has lower labor, it can work. It’s just, I’ve been sticking with what has been working. We can consolidate within China. We know how to do stuff within China. And trying to find a manufacturer in Vietnam or Cambodia (it’s another country I hear a lot) doesn’t make a lot of sense to me right now, because we are talking about shaving off maybe 5 or 10% of our COGS. It’s sacrificing like productivity with something else, right?
Dave: Yeah, I mean I think, I think really if we start exploring especially other Asian countries, you have to be dealing with such a volume where getting those incremental percentage discounts, you know, saving 5%, 10%, really starts to kind of move the needle, but if you are importing a couple of containers a year worth of product, I think there’s other ways to save that 5% or 10% opposed to sourcing from different countries.
Mike: Yeah, I totally agree. And I think also it’s easier to fix that later than try to do it upfront, because if you extrapolate out a couple of years in the future, if you have more products that you’ve already got launched on Amazon, there are good sellers already, it’s much easier to make a manufacturer shift than to save on cost and improving that profit margin. And it’s hard to grow the top line sometimes, because it takes — especially nowadays with Amazon — it takes just so much more to get products moving with inertia than it did before.
Dave: Yeah, and I think one of the things we’ve both probably experienced, really the product cost, is like, it’s a pretty micro component of the whole cost equation. The product cost might be 30% of all cost. Amazon shipping and FBA fees and other advertising fees like those are the real big hits on the bottom line. So I think there’s other ways to shift cost besides looking into other countries right now to save that 5 or 10%.
Mike: Talk about a great segue into the next question, which is: is there still opportunity to save in cost or save money I guess with shipping and inventory and cash optimization?
Dave: I think we’ll get into this a little bit in the next part. But getting into where there’s opportunities still kind of on the Amazon bones, like I mentioned before in terms of the marketing and obviously product differentiation a little bit. But the more business strategy side of things we think there is still opportunity. For me in my experiences one of the biggest ways to kind of optimize your business and take advantage of the opportunity is really just kind of optimizing your inventory. Because at the end of the day, we all only have a certain amount of money that we can invest into our businesses.
So, if you have, whether it’s $5,000 or $500,000, you can only buy so much product with that money. So it’s making sure that you are able to get the greatest return in the shortest amount of time with that money. So that’s where really, yeah, really doing accurate inventory forecast, trying to do estimates for how much you are going to sell month by month. That’s really going to be a big factor in how much money you can make importing from China opposed to necessarily picking the right product.
Mike: Yup, and where some of the real mind — let’s see, four letter word that starts with F — come into play is a lot of times when you order more inventory at one time you can get a lower cost on goods for that inventory. And you and I had this conversation and it’s just like the devil and the angel on your shoulder. The devil is like, “Yeah man order more, go for it, go for it.” And it ties up more cash, of course you think like, oh, I can get it cheaper, but there is like all these different things that kind of play into that.
I mean I know for certain within our business there is a huge opportunity still for inventory and cash optimization. That is something that I’ve talked with my staff about at length. As far as shipping goes, I think that we are doing really well there. I mean one thing that kind of ends up happening as you get larger, it’s almost unfair when you are getting started out, I mean you are a smaller guy. But once you get to the point where you are bringing in full container loads, there isn’t much advantage past that. There is really not much to shave off the shipping equation once you are bringing in like a full 40 foot HQ container. The second 40 foot HQ is the exact same price as the first.
Dave: The only thing — sorry to cut you off.
Mike: No, go ahead.
Dave: The only thing I think that you can do with that if you are importing one product in a 40 HQ yeah, you can’t really get that more efficient. But above six month’s worth of inventory; you are going to have six month’s worth of cash tied up. If you can combine two products into that 40 foot HQ, and basically now you only have your inventory tied up for three months. That I think is a way better solution than just having one 40 HQ of one product.
Yeah, if you are selling that one product, that 40 HQ, if you are selling that in like two weeks, well obviously that’s tough to improve upon. But if you are talking like months that that product is going to take to sell through, then I think there are opportunities there to consolidate freight, and really just kind of optimize both your shipping cost and your shipping times.
Mike: I need to move up to BC and drink some of your Kool-Aid so I can start going through a 40 foot HQ every two weeks.
Dave: Well, I don’t, I wish I could say I did. I don’t think I have ever actually imported a 40 HQ of one product in my life.
Mike: Well, I guess I have a link up on you though.
Dave: I know, there is a Kool-Aid in San Diego that’s way better than up here in BC.
Mike: It’s almost not freight though because it’s a product that was larger. Although I guess it wasn’t as large as the anchor. So maybe I’ll have something up for me.
Dave: Yeah, well it’s a tough time what you call floor packing a container full of anchors. It’s not quite as easy as a nice boxed item.
Mike: Yeah, that’s for sure. All right, the next thing I hear is why is there not opportunity everywhere, that the margins are lower? Most improvements now like to marketing like where — what do you see like something that’s already kind of like been figured out at this point, and you should stop like working on that particular segment and move on to something else?
Dave: I mean, it’s actually kind of expanding on the point that we just made here about selling a 40 HQ worth of product in two weeks. I think anything where there is a product that good, maybe not two weeks but like you’re selling hundreds of units a day at some ridiculous margin. I think those times are kind of gone, because people are going to catch on to that pretty much right away.
Like Jungle Scout and other tools over there, people can see if you have a really, really popular product. So I think having one product that’s private labeled, no patent, no IP, and retiring into the sunset, I think those times are gone. I think nowadays you need to have a lot bigger product catalogue. Kind of diversify yourself out amongst many, many products as opposed to having a couple of homeruns.
Mike: Yeah, I think that’s, that’s dead-on. So I’m looking forward to these next last few topics we have here. That’s things we hate about doing business in China, let’s start with that one. I can’t wait to hear your list.
Dave: Yeah, I know your thing that you hate about doing business in China that’s totally opposite for me, I guess I’ll start actually. One of the things I love about doing business in China is actually going to China. Now I know I think you are the opposite if I’m not mistaken.
Mike: That’s definitely true. I love being in Hong Kong. I look forward to every waking moment I can get to Hong Kong, but I prefer not be in China. I don’t want to say that I hate it, but I prefer not to be there.
Dave: Yeah, I mean I don’t know, for the longest I’ve loved going to China, just love the energy around you everywhere. Yeah, having millions of people around you gets really annoying really quickly, but at the same time you get tons of energy around that. I don’t know, it’s just almost like a little high that you are living off, the cheap food, the great food; I mean that part I love.
The part I don’t love about that obviously is all the pollution, all the people. It would be great if you weren’t stuck in traffic for an hour going two kilometers down the highway. But aside from that I mean, I still love going to China, and I totally recommend it to people. If they haven’t had a chance to go to China, definitely do, you might love it, you might hate it, but definitely experience it for the first time.
Mike: Yeah, I mean I think I dislike it less and less the more I go over there. I think the things that I don’t like there; they are kind of trivial and stupid things. I mean one of them, things are in no particular order, but this one is always the funny one. But just like having to use the restroom in China is a less than pleasurable experience. And it’s little things to me sometimes that just can go a long way. But yeah, I mean having to do the whole squatty potty thing unless I’m in the woods or backpacking, I prefer not to do.
Dave: Every time I think in the last two years I have gone to Beijing, there’s been actually a sit down toilet, and there’s actually been toilet paper in each one out there I have ever been to in public, but…
Mike: Come on!
Dave: I know, I know.
Mike: Yeah that was definitely an eye opener. The first time I went into a restroom there and realized that you are supposed to bring your own TP, I didn’t know that part of the custom. That was an oopsie moment, just leave it at that.
Dave: I won’t ask what you did.
Mike: I will not talk about that. This is a PG podcast.
Dave: But aside from actually going to China, is there anything like just in general doing business in China like even from afar which you really hate?
Mike: One thing I was just thinking about, this isn’t from afar but the whole like “getting you drunk at dinner” thing is, that’s kind of a love-hate thing, because I do like having a good time, but they take it a little bit too far. And when you are over there for a string of days, like having to do that like night after night after night, it gets kind of old.
So it’s fun going out and it’s like, they love to have fun which is cool. I mean the Chinese culture and everyone that I have met, they are fun people to be around. Even with the language barrier and everything sometimes it’s still… I enjoy the people like immensely. So it’s a good time, but then getting drunk six nights in a row on baijiu, it definitely, definitely takes a toll on you.
Dave: I mean I think I’m going to do a course on like how to avoid getting drunk in China, because I have this down to an art form. Like I have gotten drunk with suppliers in the past few years, maybe once.
Mike: I know how you do it because I’ve been out drinking with you. You just drop your glass because you can’t hold on to the glass. So that exactly counts but-
Dave: Even before we start the drinking I know how to bail out of it even before we begin.
Mike: Got you.
Dave: It’s definitely an art form.
Mike: To get back on what you were just asking, really what it comes down to is you are saying doing business from afar, you really kind of just answer the question right there, right? It’s like the 12 hour time change or 15 hours from the West Coast, the time it takes to get stuff from China is kind of a drag. I mean you end up with cash tied up for 30 to 45 days when your stuff is still on the water and in transit.
It forces you to be a better planner which I’m not great at inherently. I’m more organized, you’ve got to just be thinking about things way more in advance. And we just did an episode a couple of weeks ago on planning for the holidays. I mean it’s already in July and you are already thinking about the holidays.
So those things, there is definitely a language barrier, and I’m lucky, and I guess you as well, that I have a Chinese wife that happens to be mostly fluent in Chinese. So we can bail ourselves out of situations that the average person can’t by picking up the phone and having a phone call in Chinese which helps, but it’s frustrating for me because I’m kind of a control guy, and I want to take care of it myself, so I have to rely on someone else. That’s kind of frustrating.
You mentioned that China makes high quality products. I mean they are capable, I would say they are capable of making high quality products, but their custom and status quo would be to not to make it quality. So you got to like force them to like do that.
Dave: I was going to say actually.
Mike: Yeah, so I mean…
Dave: I mean it’s amazing how many corners they will cut. And like they are not even doing it just to save money on their end, like a lot of times they are actually trying to save you money. And it’s just baffling where they’ll cut corners trying to save five or ten cents. And I think it’s definitely kind of part of the Chinese psychology to just try to be as efficient as possible and save money wherever possible. And I think the quality expectations we have in the West tend to be on a way different level than in China.
Dave: So constantly trying to get those expectations through to suppliers, it’s definitely about that.
Mike: Some of my favorite stories to tell around the campfire, having a drink, is like the arguments we have with the Chinese supplier about trying to spend more money with them. It’s like I want a higher quality zipper. But no, it costs more; it costs more. Like yes I know. I want to spend two cents more on that zipper and make it higher quality. And they will like argue with you for half an hour. It’s like, it’s really the most bizarre thing. In the US they would do it in a heartbeat. Not only that, they mark it up and charge you much more to create the product. So, some of that stuff is pretty funny.
Dave: Yeah, I know, I was just going to say, I mean I just went through this actually a few weeks ago. I made it really clear to the supplier this needs to be packaged in a white box, white box, make sure it’s a white box. They sent photos of the final shipment before it’s about to ship, everything in a brown box.
Mike: Yeah, it’s amazing, it really is. So yeah, I was just going to end, and we are getting pretty close to our time here, I was going to end on the things that we love about doing in China or doing business in China. And for me, I don’t know, I think it’s cool. I mean we’ve lived abroad before ourselves. We’ve been exposed to this global world when we were doing online poker and I don’t know, as much as I love the United States and North America, whatever you want to call it, I mean it’s neat just operating in this global world. Like seeing other cultures, doing business in other languages and other places, and having the opportunity to travel. That part I just absolutely love that aspect of it. Even though travelling to China gets tough doing it a couple of times a year, it’s still pretty cool. Like if I had to pick between doing that and just like never leaving Wichita, Kansas or something, I mean I would, I prefer to be doing this global thing. I think that’s just a need, a personal achievement kind of thing I guess if anything.
Dave: And I think the greatest thing about even whether it’s going over there or just doing business in China from your home in America or Canada or wherever you are, is the fact that Chinese suppliers and the Chinese people overall I think are incredibly welcoming, friendly, especially dealing with businesses in China. There might be quality issues, timing issues, that type of thing, but the possibility of ever getting scammed outright is almost minimal.
And I think what I always tell people, I think that you have a way higher chance of being ripped off dealing with a business in Canada opposed with China. I mean they are incredibly honest overall. Again you have to get around quality issues sometimes, but overall I mean incredibly honest country to do business in.
Mike: I will still urge you to protect yourself. Do the due diligence, do the factory inspection. Make sure that they are a legitimate factory, make sure that the wire transfer information matches the business you are sending. There are definitely scams over there, but I have also been incredibly lucky. I think, I guess fortunate I should say, not lucky, I think you make your own luck in this particular case. We’ve been fortunate that the people that we’ve worked with have done a great job for us, right, and it’s really enjoyable.
The other thing that I was going to say about loving doing this whole Chinese thing, it’s just been really cool like building our own products from scratch. I mean we don’t just, as you guys know from listening to this podcast, we don’t just go to Alibaba, and get some random product and just stick our name on it. We go the extra mile and try to make it as differentiated as possible. And going through that process, it’s just been really cool.
I realize that we could do that elsewhere in the world, but it’s really not feasible to do that within the United States. And we can get into a whole argument about jobs and things like this. But I mean the reality is in a globalized world, these are jobs that should not be in North America. And you don’t want high labor, uneducated labor type jobs in a first world country like this. I mean we are better off having the higher educated, more sophisticated jobs. Making gel pens makes sense to do over in China, or Vietnam or whatever that would be in a country where the wage is lower. So I know, that part of the ride has been really cool for me.
Dave: Yup, I couldn’t agree. Something else seeing a sausage made I guess.
Mike: Yeah. Yeah cool, I think we are good to go in this episode as far as timing goes. I just want to throw a few programming notes out. First of all just a reminder by the EcomCrew podcast is now sponsored by Stamped.io. So go ahead and check them out if you are in need for some product reviews over on your Shopify store. They only work with Shopify right now. We’ve been using them now with all of our brands, and very happy with stamped.io, and want to thank them for sponsoring the EcomCrew podcast.
Another programming note is travel schedule for me speaking. If you want to see me speak live in an event, I’m going to be — I got three things on the schedule — the Ecommerce All Stars in Austin Texas, Ezra Firestone’s event. August 4th and 5th I’ll be speaking there twice actually. Global sources, if you guys are heading over to Hong Kong or China for the Canton Fair, or the Global sources event, I’ll be there October 17th through 19th. Also speaking there two times, two different talks for the Global Sources event. And then the Ecom Fuel, the Ecommerce Fuel event. I think that's sold out now, but if you are heading out there, I’d love to meet with you in Laguna California, January 11th through 13th.
And one final note, we mentioned it before, go to EcomCrew.com/course, that’s EcomCrew.com/course. Sign up over there, give us your email; we’ll email you when Dave and I get through our first course; we are developing it right now. I think you guys will be excited about it. Anyone who signs up early will get a 25% discount that will not be offered to anyone else. And I think you guys are going to really like the course. So go over to EcomCrew.com/course. We are going to release it just to the people on that list first just to kind of test it out and make sure everyone is happy with it and give them a discount for helping out there.
But as you guys know everything that we do, we work really hard on it. Dave and I partnered up on this podcast because we have similar philosophies of not cutting corners or anything. And we’ve been putting a lot of work into this course. I’m thinking you guys will absolutely love it, and we have more down the pipe. So EcomCrew.com/course and I think that’s about it. Any other final notes Dave?
Dave: No, I think that’s it, and I guess we’ll continue the conversation in part two.
Mike: Yeah, part two next week. We have a pretty good line up here to kind of continue this conversation. So we’ll talk to you guys next week. Until then happy selling and we’ll talk to you then.
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